quote:

Originally posted by PackOly:
I may have mistaken Lukey as one of the Favre bashers. It just seemed he was only coming around after losses lately, much like CoP, only to a lesser extent. It just gets tiring when that happens.

Lukey is in second place to Badgerzfan for the "I wish Favre would molest me" prize. Max is coming up fast though.

A lot of the negative posters had disappeared the last couple of months, some sobered up, others just crawled back under their rock.

Now it's hard not to admit this team's talent level has been steadily improving since ROTTT. MM is a lot like the core of the team young and inexperienced. Hopefully more positive experience is coming their way!

quote:

Originally posted by PackOly:
A lot of the negative posters had disappeared the last couple of months, some sobered up, others just crawled back under their rock.

Now it's hard not to admit this team's talent level has been steadily improving since ROTTT. MM is a lot like the core of the team young and inexperienced. Hopefully more positive experience is coming their way!

YUP!

I have a hard time understanding why people think he is some sort of ageless wonder who can play for 2 or 3 more years. It is time to get over it and let the team move on without him.

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by PackOly:
I may have mistaken Lukey as one of the Favre bashers. It just seemed he was only coming around after losses lately, much like CoP, only to a lesser extent. It just gets tiring when that happens.

Lukey is in second place to Badgerzfan for the "I wish Favre would molest me" prize. Max is coming up fast though.

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:
The Broncos wait for you when Favre retires.

He's one guy who plays football, made millions of dollars, has carte blanche in Wisconsin and will ride off into the sunset happy as a clam making millions more on his reputation. If that's all you can root for then you are a bad fan.

Being a fan of a team is more than a bunch of guys playing a game. It's a cultural commons we all can enjoy. Favre is just one part of a elaborate team history that binds that cultural commons across generations. How many were just Cecil Isabel, Don Hutson, Bart Starr, Lombardi, etc fans?

I don't give a rip if Favre retires this year or not. He's one player and life goes on. If your association with the sport, that cultural commons, is through one guy it's merely a reflection of how shallow the sport and the fans have become.


Let the grab ass fest continue.

Your traditional bluntness notwithstanding, you make a fair point. And you'll note I recognize that it's a kind of selfish approach to be thinking most of one guy (granted, the oldest guy on the team).

Nobody said they were "just" a Favre fan. But considering I was born in 1968, the Favre Era is the only really successful one I've lived through. The '80s were fun, at times, but we were always second-rate. Tough not to associate Favre with virtually the only time I've rooted for the Packers that they've actually been pretty good. And hell, I think there probably were plenty of Packers fans whose support for the team developed primarily in the 60s, and maybe were huge fans of Bart Starr, or whoever. (Maybe helps explain why he was our head coach for a fairly lengthy period of time.)

In any case, your point on the cultural commons is legit, and regardless I'm not going anywhere when Favre retires, it will probably just take me a while to identify with his successor as the guy who's been around for half of my existence and consequently most of my life as a fan.

It will be a shame if Favre does retire without them winning another Superbowl but let's be honest here- his legacy is what it is (i.e. very solid) and winning another Superbowl should not change that fact.

That being said, it's obvious he's been a part of some colossal playoff meltdowns in recent history. If this is what we have come to expect (and we are OK with that) then maybe it's time for him to retire.

quote:

Originally posted by Goalline:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

Yawn....

The cultural commons bit actually cuts in favor of caring more about how some players fare than others. The team's legends are particularly salient pieces of the team's history, so the strength of their legacies is of particular importance.

I like Favre and he has been a great player for the Packers for many years.

There is a small part of me that would like to see Favre win another Super Bowl. There is a much bigger part of me that couldn't care less if he takes another snap for the Packers. Ya, it would be nice and a feel good story to end his career but I want Packer Super Bowls. If Favre is the QB that's great, if it is Rex Grossman I'd still be happy with the SB's.

quote:

Originally posted by Goalline:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

yup.

Guess I'm not sure it's THAT big a deal. I've been a Red Sox fan since I was a little kid. I watched heartbreaking losses that were arguably more unlikely than 4th and 26. So when they won that World Series in 2004 I was ecstatic. But hey, a small part of me felt bad for Nomar Garciaparra, who had been a great Sox player for a decade and was traded away mere months before they won the title. Doesn't mean that I wanted them to lose, I was thought it was too bad that an important part of their recent history wasn't part of it.

Is rooting for some players specifically on a team you love such a bad thing? Otherwise you are in some respects, as Seinfeld said, rooting for laundry.

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:

quote:

Originally posted by Goalline:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

Yawn....

I know, lawnmowing is boring.

quote:

With that said, thru 40 yrs of watching the Packers, watching them with Brett Favre as QB has brought more joy to my football watching than any other time in my life. He his like my kid. He makes mistakes and I want to ring his neck and when it is all said and done I want to hug him.

Beautifully said and it applies to me as well.

BUT, when I put my thinking hat on (try real hard not to romanticize things), I place Favre 6-10 all time where I would LIKE to be able to place him Top 2 or 3 all time.

Every QB makes mistakes. I remember Montana threw a pass right into a Bengal's hands in the key final drive that won their second SB over the Bengals.

So, even Montana.

But, regretfully, with thinking cap on, I just see it that Favre is a notch below because of the frequency of DECISION-MAKING mistakes.

One thing I couldn't help wondering. My mind shifted back to Starr engineering that final drive in Ice Bowl I. He was NOT going to make a mistake!!! NO WAY!!!

If I had my choice, I would rather have had that Bart Starr at the helm yesterday than Brett Favre. BUT, this makes one huge allowance. Not Starr at 38. No, that Starr could not have done it. Favre is a physical freak to be able to play at his level at 38. Elway's the only other one I can think of in that respect.

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:

quote:

Originally posted by Goalline:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

Yawn....

Keep yawning half wit. Your character is as bankrupt as your moniker. Almost like you knew what you were doing.

quote:

Keep yawning half wit.

Stop the personal attacks or get your ass out of this board - for good.

I have no idea why you have the leash you do. You transgress forum policy at a frequency that no one has rivaled.

quote:

Originally posted by lukey:
The cultural commons bit actually cuts in favor of caring more about how some players fare than others. The team's legends are particularly salient pieces of the team's history, so the strength of their legacies is of particular importance.

He is one piece of a whole fabric. While greats like Favre stand out, it is the Chester Marcols that make for memories as well. Good and bad serve their purpose in identity. If all you can do is relish the high points and not except the low you're nothing more than a stuffed shirt bandwagon jumper.

quote:

Originally posted by phaedrus:

quote:

Keep yawning half wit.

Stop the personal attacks or get your ass out of this board - for good.

I have no idea why you have the leash you do. You transgress forum policy at a frequency that no one has rivaled.

Blow it out your ass closeted conspiracy priest. You want to play make believe with your life you go right ahead. I have no time for it.

I want the team to win the Superbowl next year, if that is w/o Favre, so be it. I also believe that with the core now, another year of seasoning, and some personnel upgrade, Favre could be the guy under center when they play in that Superbowl. He may have thrown a crappy pass, but he is not without skills or leadership. The day he can't do it anymore he needs to hang 'em up. This season looked to me like a guy who can still get the job done (to the tune of 28 TD, 15 INTs, and over 4,000 yards). I know he can't do it forever, but I don't hate on the guy for doing it while he can.

In summery, I understand the phenomenon of fascination with the back up QB, I also understand the hero worship, I'm just saying there is a middle ground (i.e everyone but me is wrong). Expect Favre to do what he did in most games this year and hammer him when he doesn't.

quote:

Originally posted by phaedrus:

quote:

Keep yawning half wit.

Stop the personal attacks or get your ass out of this board - for good.

I have no idea why you have the leash you do. You transgress forum policy at a frequency that no one has rivaled.

No Kidding. I mean, c'mon, everyone knows Michael Milken was a victim. Viva la junk bonds!

BTW, did he have the best toupe ever or what? I didn't realize he was bald until he came out of the slammer.

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:

quote:

Originally posted by Goalline:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

Yawn....

Keep yawning half wit. Your character is as bankrupt as your moniker. Almost like you knew what you were doing.

Is that all you can come up with? I expected much much better.

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:

quote:

Originally posted by Goalline:

quote:

Originally posted by Henry:

quote:

Originally posted by Milken:
There is a big part of me that would be disappointed for Brett if the Packers remain contenders - perhaps win another SB - without him.

That's truly pathetic.

There is a part of me that wishes that y'all would follow him to Misissipi after his playing days are over and cheer for him on his mower. I would say that is beyond pathetic.

Yawn....

Keep yawning half wit. Your character is as bankrupt as your moniker. Almost like you knew what you were doing.

Is that all you can come up with? I expected much much better.

Can only do so much with a pile of dog schit.

Elway won the Super Bowl against the Packers with about 85 yards passing. He managed the game with an excellent running game with Davis and a pressuring defense. FAvre at 38 is better than Elway at 38 but he can't carry a team like he did when he was 28. Favre at 28 would have won the game last night by himself. But with no running game or at teh very least a Coach who decided he didn't want to rely on it, a defense that was on a coffee break, Favre at 38 could not do it.