There are nearly 100 QBs on NFL rosters right now. Why in the world is Rex not one of them? I'm pretty sure he's better than a few of the STARTERS out there, much less 2nd and 3rd stringers.

For all the lumps he's taken, he's still young, still has a strong arm, and is still capable of getting hot. He played pretty well down the stretch in 2007, after he was benched, and did admirably against Tennessee last year filling-in for Orton.

Are he and his agent, Drew Rosenhaus, insisting on a starting job? That's the only reason I could imagine why he'd be passed-over in favor of the has-beens and never-weres filling-out some team's depth charts right now.

What about the Vikings? I'd take Grossman over both Jackson and Rosenfels, even before factoring in his rapport with Berrian, his excellent play action passing (which would be killer with AP at RB), and the fact he'd be playing in a dome, which would play to his strength--the deep ball.

What am I missing here?

B-N-D

NFL GMs disagree with you that he's better than the starters out there. Any of them.

He hasn't got a job as a backup either because he's looking for a starting job, and GMs don't want to sign that kind of player to be a veteran backup (i.e., someone who believes he's better than he is and deserves to be starting), or because people want safe, conservative types as veteran backups -- which isn't Grossman.

He probably is better than a lot of third-stringers, but people tend to like developmental guys in that spot -- their own draft picks. They don't want to kick a recent draft pick off the roster who might one day develop into something for somebody who's already been proven to be wildly erratic and inconsistent, and has probably developed as much as he's ever going to.

I think Grossman has probably entered that stage of his career (along with the also unemployed J.P. Losman, and Gus Frerotte) where he has to hope somebody gets injured -- either a starter or veteran backup -- before he gets a call.

Good reply, Max.

You mentioned J.P. Losman--there's another guy I'd be pleased to have as my back-up QB if I were a GM. Like Grossman, he's still pretty young and has had some success. (He was the highest rated QB in the AFC for about the first 1/3 of the 2006 season.)

It seems like he and Grossman are in a gray area--young QBs without enough success or talent to be trusted with a starting job, but too much to simply be content accepting a back-up position with minimal pay and virtually no shot of seeing action.

B-N-D

Contrary to what many GMs think, Rex is a better QB than a few of the current starters and more than a few 2nd stringers. He has gotten a really over-hyped {bad} media image and it seems to overshadow his actual ability. He would be a perfectly good 2nd guy on many teams and yes probably is better than either QB the Vikes have....at least right now.

I don't care for Grossman either but I can't believe he's not at least a #2 guy on some team.

Maybe his attitude or personality has really turned off NFL teams but he certainly has talent to at least compete for a starting job or play as a backup.

Whats weird is that Rex hasn't shown any actual bad attitude or personality traits, In Chicago he always seemed to say the right things to the media, worked hard with the team and rehabbing from 2 major injuries. His teammates only seemed to have good things to say about him. His only off comment I remember was his Super Bowl week statement about how ignorant the media was about game preparations. It makes you wonder if that sent the media on a vendetta against him. Yeah he had a bad Super Bowl game but the media acted he was the worst QB ever in a SB (he wasn't) and later acted like he was just a horrible joke of a player when guys with far more questionable attitudes and bad histories seemed to get a pass. Even some Bears fans bought into the idea that he has a bad attitude but when you ask them why they can't explain it. I mean really how many pounds of flesh does it take to satisfy the media vultures?

C'mon. GMs have their own scouts, their own talent evaluators, their own people reviewing tapes on every available free agent. Do you really think they ignore an available player because of a "media vendetta"? It's one thing to avoid a guy who brings horrible PR like say Michael Vick. The most likely reason teams haven't signed Rex Grossman is that they don't think he's any good.

In 31 career starts he's completed just over half his passes, thrown 35 INTs, and fumbled 19 times. In his year and a half as a starter in Chicago he got sacked 46 times -- twice per game -- and that was in a run-based offense that had a pretty decent offensive line for at least one of those seasons.

In short, he has marginal accuracy, takes a lot of sacks, and serves up a lot of turnovers. He lost his job to Kyle Orton, who the Bears themselves were so thrilled with that they gave him away along with two first-round picks to acquire Jay Cutler. Wow, it's a mystery why NFL GMs aren't eager to sign him.

quote:

Originally posted by BearNDesert:
There are nearly 100 QBs on NFL rosters right now. Why in the world is Rex not one of them?

- Shhhhh ... don't say it too loud CKA might do something smart.

quote:

Originally posted by BearNDesert:


his agent, Drew Rosenhaus,

B-N-D

There is reason one right there. Many GMs are sick of Rosenhaus and just won't deal with him, especially with a marginal player.

Another reason is probably $$$$. He will still want starter money even tho he is a back up.

Look at your own Bears roster. Isn't Rexxy better than Caleb Hanle or Brett Basanez? Apparently Jerry Angelo, Lovie Smith, Ron Turner and Pep Hamilton don't think so.

quote:

Originally posted by Max:
the Bears themselves were so thrilled with that they gave him away along with two first-round picks to acquire Jay Cutler. Wow, it's a mystery why NFL GMs aren't eager to sign him.

Good stuff here. I can't wait to hear the excuse factory from the trolls.

quote:

Originally posted by pakrbakr:
Good stuff here. I can't wait to hear the excuse factory from the trolls.

I love you, man. I'd like to give you a big hug .

No excuses here. I have no vested interest one way or the other, but I've watched enough football to know there aren't 100 QBs better than Grossman. I've watched games where he's been absolutely dominant. I'm just surprised no GM is willing to take a chance on a pretty young guy with a big arm and big game experience.

Credit to Ammo and Max for expanding the discussion with some viable explanations.

B-N-D

Rex will probably catch on during training camp somewhere when injuries/bustouts/etc occur. At least when DR decides to take a reasonable offer for backup $.

The idea that Bears fans really care that much about a former player to make a buch of excuses for him is and

I guess we could start multiple threads over many months vilifying/glorifying our former player(s) and constantly butt heads on it but instead we wish them well (whether we like them or not) and move forward (for better or worse). Besides it seems Packer fans hold all the records in that type of thing so we leave them to it.

I actually do think he'll get signed eventually as a No. 2. I just don't think teams see it as a priority -- "don't want to let this guy get away," or anything. He'll get a job during the preseason when some teams discovers their own No. 2 is washed up or something.

Remember, Byron Leftwich was in the same boat a year ago, and he had about as much NFL success as Grossman or Losman. Aside from Grossman's trip to the Super Bowl, which he himself gets (or deserves) little credit for.

I think you and I agree on that scenario Max.

The media onslaught on Rex forgets that in '06 he had 3-4 real bad games but still played quite well in the rest and made key plays to win 2 playoff games going 15-4 as a starter. Its all apparently forgotten by the hacks, oh well....

quote:

Originally posted by BearBite:
Contrary to what many GMs think, Rex is a better QB than a few of the current starters

We need names.

When you got a QB more concerned about the Dec. 31 festivities than beating the Packers on a nationally televised game, there aren't many ball boys that could be worse than that Schlub.

quote:

Originally posted by PackerHawk:

quote:

Originally posted by BearBite:
Contrary to what many GMs think, Rex is a better QB than a few of the current starters

We need names.

I can't speak for BB, but I already mentioned I'd take Grossman over anybody in Minny right now. I'd also take him over Jamarcus Russell (he's atrocious). Grossman's also likely better than many of the guys locked in QB battles with the Bucs, the Jets and the Broncos.

B-N-D

quote:

Originally posted by BearNDesert:
Grossman's also likely better than many of the guys locked in QB battles with the Bucs, the Jets and Broncos.

You know that the Bears themselves benched Grossman for Griese (with the Bucs) and Orton (with the Broncos), right? If even the team that knows Grossman best didn't think he was better than those players, why would you?

The Jets are clearly going to be the Ravens North this year: lots of running and defense, very little passing. The last thing they want at quarterback is a guy like Grossman.

quote:

Originally posted by Max:

quote:

Originally posted by BearNDesert:
Grossman's also likely better than many of the guys locked in QB battles with the Bucs, the Jets and Broncos.

You know that the Bears themselves benched Grossman for Griese (with the Bucs) and Orton (with the Broncos), right? If even the team that knows Grossman best didn't think he was better than those players, why would you?

I do know that. I also know that Griese was pretty horrible, and the first excuse the Bears had to get Grossman back in (Griese got an owie and had to leave for a couple plays) he was back and played pretty well. Had Grossman not gotten hurt (yet again) he probably would have been the starting QB going into 2008.

Orton was anointed the starter at the end of a QB competition in training camp (a competition most observers felt Grossman won, incidentally) and played some pretty good games and some pretty horrid ones (just like Grossman), only w/o the arm strength. He was a little SAFER with the football, but BETTER? Not sure he provided a body of work that would lead to that conclusion. (Hell, if you hand-picked 7 or 8 games from the Bear's 2006 season you'd say Grossman was a future Hall of Famer.) The Bears liked Orton so much they were critical of his play after the season and shipped him away a few weeks later. He's now losing a QB competition with Chris Simms (!) who spent most of 2008 on his back in the hospital.

As for the Jets, the question was "which QBs is Grossman better than" not which organization should Grossman play for. If all you want is a QB to be careful with the ball and throw the occasional check-down pass, then you're right--Grossman isn't your man.

B-N-D

I didn't say that I thought Orton was better than Grossman, just that the Bears did. I have no preference, I don't think either one is any good.

Anyway, you're talking as if "better" is all about arm strength or mobility or whatever. Being safer with the football is also a component of being "better," and it's probably why some of the player who arguably have less physical talent than him are considered better, and why they have jobs and he doesn't.

quote:

Originally posted by Max:

Anyway, you're talking as if "better" is all about arm strength or mobility or whatever. Being safer with the football is also a component of being "better," and it's probably why some of the player who arguably have less physical talent than him are considered better, and why they have jobs and he doesn't.

Totally agree. And you made some valid points regarding the preference of most GMs to have a safe, game-manager type as a back-up to a guy who's careless with the football and would demand/expect a salary above his worth.

Leftwich and Culpepper had trouble finding jobs last year, and now guys like Losman and Grossman are having trouble this year. Still, like you said in a previous post--I expect both will find work and maybe even see the field at some point this year.

B-N-D

Could it be that the other QB's that are on the rosters can actually take a snap from center?

quote:

Originally posted by GBFanForLife:
Could it be that the other QB's that are on the rosters can actually take a snap from center?

Have you seen the guy's hands? Tiny.

B-N-D

quote:

Originally posted by Max:
C'mon. GMs have their own scouts, their own talent evaluators, their own people reviewing tapes on every available free agent. Do you really think they ignore an available player because of a "media vendetta"? It's one thing to avoid a guy who brings horrible PR like say Michael Vick. The most likely reason teams haven't signed Rex Grossman is that they don't think he's any good.

In 31 career starts he's completed just over half his passes, thrown 35 INTs, and fumbled 19 times. In his year and a half as a starter in Chicago he got sacked 46 times -- twice per game -- and that was in a run-based offense that had a pretty decent offensive line for at least one of those seasons.

In short, he has marginal accuracy, takes a lot of sacks, and serves up a lot of turnovers. He lost his job to Kyle Orton, who the Bears themselves were so thrilled with that they gave him away along with two first-round picks to acquire Jay Cutler. Wow, it's a mystery why NFL GMs aren't eager to sign him.

Damn.

Ouch.

quote:

Originally posted by DeepChicago:

quote:

Originally posted by Max:
C'mon. GMs have their own scouts, their own talent evaluators, their own people reviewing tapes on every available free agent. Do you really think they ignore an available player because of a "media vendetta"? It's one thing to avoid a guy who brings horrible PR like say Michael Vick. The most likely reason teams haven't signed Rex Grossman is that they don't think he's any good.

In 31 career starts he's completed just over half his passes, thrown 35 INTs, and fumbled 19 times. In his year and a half as a starter in Chicago he got sacked 46 times -- twice per game -- and that was in a run-based offense that had a pretty decent offensive line for at least one of those seasons.

In short, he has marginal accuracy, takes a lot of sacks, and serves up a lot of turnovers. He lost his job to Kyle Orton, who the Bears themselves were so thrilled with that they gave him away along with two first-round picks to acquire Jay Cutler. Wow, it's a mystery why NFL GMs aren't eager to sign him.

Damn.

Ouch.

And now you know why we say "The Bears Suck!" And when Cutler repeats Grossman's performance we can say "The Bears Still Suck!!"